I-45 Killer, Tim Miller, and Jack

0:00 This program is designed to provide general information with regards to the subject matters covered. This information is given with the understanding that neither the hosts, guests, sponsors, or station are engaged in rendering any specific and personal medical, financial, legal counseling, professional service, or any advice. You should seek the services. Of competent professionals before applying or trying any suggested ideas.

0:52 Good Morning, True Seekers and true crime junkies. Welcome back to another episode of Hit the Roadjack Finding the Zodiac. I'd like to welcome to the show today, Nolan del Campo. Good morning, everybody, Good. Morning, and Harriet Souchet, good morning, Good morning. I didn't have any real news or laundry to pour out, so we're just climbing right back into the case of Laura Miller and Tim Miller. We're going to go right back into the presentation. I've got some things that I'd really like to discuss today that I thought was very important, one of them being is that I had her date of disappearance incorrect. I had it down as September first, nineteen eighty four. However, I laid down to go to bed last night and found myself in the middle of the Killing Fields documentary with Tim Miller and of course their favorite two suspects, which we've talked a little bit about one of them.

1:46 We've talked a little. Bit, I think about both of them, but they reported on that documentary. September tenth, nineteen eighty four, is the date that Laura Ann Miller went missing from the convenience store, attempting to call her boyfriend to see if he would come over. So I did get a bit more information on that last night. So it appears as though Tim Miller had literally just moved from Dickinson, which Dickinson has some inclination to the cases and to League City, and he was after moving in, they hadn't had their home phone set up yet, and Laura Miller actually had gone to a payphone, had her mother driver to a phone, tell her mother, you know, leave me here, I can walk home. And it turns out that her house is literally within houses of Heidi Villa Real five, who also went missing the year previous, and was going to the payphone as well to make a phone call, supposedly at the same little convenience store that Laura Miller had gone to.

2:51 So after catching up with that correction. It just tells you how much the media will print and produce things without making sure that they're accurate. Because all the information I had research research showed September first, but it was actually September tenth. Of nineteen eighty four. So moving on with that. Where we left off last week was talking a little bit about the one of the suspects for Tim Miller, and this is let's see, this is Clyde Hendrickson. He is he was actually convicted and went to prison for abuse of a corpse. Which is only could literally prove because he had been dating this gal.

3:35 They supposedly left the bar one night, went out to a watering hole where they were going to go swimming, and for whatever reason ellen Beeson had he claimed that she drowned, and then he put her body into the truck was going to take her to the hospital, but then got scared dumped her with some trash on the side. Some of the things are a knowledge heart under couch and some tires. It said, yes, yes, so the. Interesting that's okay. The interesting part about it is that where they were finding all of the girls once they started stumbling on them, and it took them some time I guess the first body was found in April of nineteen eighty four, which would have been a Heidi Figh, And then I guess Tim Miller at this point in time had also indicated that he believed that they should check that same area when they found her body, but it took them another two years for somebody to accidentally stumble upon his well, seventeen months, I guess is what he said, for somebody else to stumble upon his daughter's or another body, and then in the finding of that body, they then found.

4:44 Tim Miller's daughter's body. So now that we've got that straight, here's one of the excerpts. And of course, this particular documentary series that I'm watching last night was filmed and produced in twenty twenty two, and this is the approximate time that Tim Mill reached out to me to find out whether or not I still believed Jack was the Zodiac, and which I did confirm to him, Yes, that is still my belief. We had a short conversation. I told him that I would like to, you know, speak with him more, and things have elevated, things have come much further research, more research has been done. I would be interested in discussing things with him, but I haven't been able to get him back on the phone since. One of those reasons I think is is because also in twenty twenty two he took out this wrongful conviction case against Clyde Hedricks. Let's see so Tim Miller, founder of Texas Equisearch, receives a twenty four million dollar civil suit for wrongful death against Clyde Hedrick in Galveston. The difference again is that Clyde dumped beeson under trash to hide the body. The girls in the killing fields were all laid underneath trees, and as Harriot had said, the prominence.

5:53 Out was that they were basically posed, posed and laid beneath these trees, so uh locations that the bodies were found. And if Clyde was if he was so scared that he just dumped Beason's body somewhere he seemed, he would have been rather collected. I would assume if he had killed these other girls and just casually took them to a place where he continually dropped. And dumped more bodies, that was one of my thoughts. So basically they said a man convicted in nineteen eighty four death of a woman has been released from prison, and I think that's the other thing. In the time frame in which they found her.

6:33 Body was close to the timeframe in which they found Fi's body, so they wanted to then clump these acts together. Did you have something to say. Nolan, Oh no, I'm just comfortable injury, your butt hurt. Where there's two out of three butt hurt people. Here today, well actually three people. No, your numbs. They used to call you numb something bad word. Now they can call me them.

7:15 But. Instead numb nuts. Because we're going to go to off the. Rails here, Yes we will. Clyde Hedrick, sixty seven, was released from the Estelle unit in Huntsville on Monday on mandatory supervision. According to the Texas Department of Criminal Justice, Hendrick's name is one that Texas Equisearch founder and director Tim Miller is all too familiar with. He's not in prison right now, and he's free to go, Miller said. Miller's daughter, Laura Miller, was abducted and murdered in nineteen eighty four. While Hedrick was not charged in her case, Miller believes Hedrick played a role that leads to the thought that there is more than one person involved, right, I mean, obviously.

7:57 For sure, Yeah, do the other teeth. He did. He was actually a NASA scientist. And wait till we get to some of the state that is, that's Robert Abele's let's. And Clyde. I mean, Clyde was not a bad looking guy in his day. He wasn't. I mean, I know we see this picture now, but like he was, he was an okay looking guy. But he was a construction worker. I feel like if you're working construction, you're working hard, long days. So if you're taking time away from the person you're with to go around and murder. People, I don't know. You guys need to get the icy hotlight a Caine roll on. That's in the private chat guys. It says that I still remember every minute of that seventeen months Laura was missing, and the helplessness and the hopelessness and the fear, Miller said. According to court records, Hedrick was convicted of involuntary manslaughter in twenty fourteen for the nineteen eighty four death of Ellen Beeson. I am not sure why it took that long for them to figure out he was the one that killed her, since he was the one that left the bar with her, and the last time she was seen at the bar was with him and leaving with him. That it took that long for him to actually be convicted. But that is the case, thirty years, I think thirty.

9:19 Yeah, that's what it looks like. So that's. So I had. I did actually have a YouTuber comment. This is ed Edwards Cipher's he's constantly working on letters, though he doesn't, or at least he's stated to me he doesn't have handwriting of his suspect, Ed Edwards in order to make any comparisons, but he believes that and I don't know how he believes that Ed Edwards is in the midst of all of these, you know, ciphers and codes and things like that, because he hasn't really given me any information. But he responded with the link that I gave everybody from image shack, which we saw on the previous screen here, and it's this image shack IMG eighty three dot image shack dot us forward slash I forward slash I forty five kill eight mh dot jpg and that obviously begins with an http colon ford slash forward slash. Now, what I have learned with some of the some of the fraud seminars that I've been to is that an HTTPS means that it's a trusted site, whereas an HTTP means that it is not. I don't know what that means for image shack, because I do recognize that lots of people were putting images on there back in the day.

10:35 This the YouTube comment was that the sad badge image is no longer there. Correct. This is what I was, I guess attempting to say, or start with the last time that we spoke was that the images were placed up there in two thousand and six. So when I was able to access them and go to where they were, they listed that they had been put up in two thousand and six, was one year basically after Tim Miller had found or had received the letter in the mail, and he received one version which was a cutout version of news clippings and stuff, which we'll get to here in a minute. But he said that inside of a year he went back to ask for I guess a copy or what have you of that letter, and they were and they told him that letter was gone. So the shock to him was to find me now in possession of a copy of it and deciphering the linguistics on it to what I believe is a good fit for Jack Terrence as the Zodiac and many other crimes, they think that he can be placed in the proximity of or has the training and capability to have committed.

11:40 So definitely a cryptic message said to Tim, Yes, yes, this one, because I think. I'm coming up to that. I'm coming up to that. I'm just saying that I think the copy that I used came from you and did this. Well, it had to have come from me because evidently nobody else was in possession of it. When Tim Miller was at my house, he put me on the phone with somebody either the former head of the FBI or somebody that was head of the FBI at the time, and we spoke. I gave him the information on who the email came from. I gave him the image URL, which I still have today, and they stated they could not source fine or trace anything back to this sad badge.

12:23 And again, very strange that Tim Miller's letter goes missing inside of the year and it's being. Produced on the internet. That made me think when he said sad Badge image is no longer there, which is something I already knew, is that I wanted to go back on the wayback Machine and take a look at the wayback machine. You can usually put a URL in. This is how I've gone and seen many things on Tom Voyd's site from the early two thousand's late nineteen nineties. So I put the. URL in there and I saw something that said images. So I thought what I was going to be doing was searching images when I used that URL. But when I clicked on images and it dropped down, it is extremely interesting to see that the Cleveland Museum of Art number one, but literally to the right it says top NASA Images, Solar System Collection and AIMS Research Center.

13:16 So this is somehow connected to the wayback Machine. And if you don't know what the wayback machine is, it is a spider that crawls the Internet, and it logs and catalogs every instance of URLs and websites and pages and so forth, and it collects them into history so that you can later go back on the wayback Machine and look at things that are no longer visible on the Internet if you don't have the URL. So in Tom Boyd's case, I actually plugged in his URL for his website with AOL before he tore everything down, revamped it, and restarted a new website in regards to the zodiac, Which why do that stick with what you've got?

13:58 That to me is almost like a cleanup if you're going to go and take there and I whitewash. Yeah, yeah, let's let's clear everything to find that this URL is actually not on there, which is kind of the next phase here. So here's me putting in that URL on the wayback Machine and it says wayback Machine is not archived that URL, and that it says click here to search for all archived pages under that URL. But it comes back with nothing. So whoever was able to remove this was able to scrub it, not just from the Internet by removing it from the Internet, but scrub it from the Internet because it cannot be found or located in something like the wayback Machine.

14:48 And here is that letter by outside influence, but that you might have been pressured by outside influences to edit is present y. Therefore he changes medium. Well, you know what I think about the name, the anonymous name that the person who provided it to me sad badge. You know somebody who is obviously disappointed in law for some reason. I mean, why else name yourself sad badge? Why would you do that? Ment? Exactly? So, here is the letter. To the left is the one with the cutouts, albeit it's black and white. We don't have a color version. Of this, and we see all of the different words that it actually took to make this particular letter. All the way to the bottom. The one to the right was a second image that was on image shack, and this one appears as though some individual attempted to trace the cutout version, so we see what looks more like handprinting on there, or at least tracing of the letters is what they did. Now, I don't know why anybody would want to do that, and to me, that makes no sense to have to take the time to, you know, try to reinvent this letter through handwriting.

16:06 When there was this version that was strong and clear that you could see. One of the things I thought that if this was something that the zodiac did, because we knew that he would make two and three communications basically with the same message, and he would he would keep or not keep, but send them out to multiple locations. So my first question was, was this the Zodiac attempting to create that second or third communication that we were unaware of. And who was this sent to? And how did this sad badge find it on the internet connected to the cutout version that Tim Miller had received. All of these are very good questions that I fear we're never going to get answers to because the FBI says they can't track.

16:48 The person who's responsible for this. This is the oh, and I want to remind everybody so in this it says this monster in me that makes me kill other Caucasian girls with brown hair. Second in the Eighties series or the League City Fields of Death. So he is calling two different, three different sets of serial killings here, two sets of the eighties and the League City Fields. He identifies them as completely different serial killing sprees, but also acknowledging that somebody else is involved, just like Tim Miller thought, just like Harriet's solves are coming out to say, so, there is an inclination in here that there are more people killing, not necessarily that the Zodiac or Jack is involved with these individuals, but just like the Zodiac, he's saying, I didn't do that.

17:44 Somebody else did. So just like the bomb on the police steps. Back in the Zodiac era when he said, look, guys, don't come at me just because I talked about a bomb, because I'm not the. Person that bombed the officers. If they had the wrong guy, he wanted to reach out and say, that's not the person you're looking for. And we're going to see that kind of stuff in this letter when we get to two thousand and five and we break down the linguistics. Another interesting part about this is not only did the individual trace the cutouts from the letter side, but they also did it from the envelope side. And when you look. At this particular communication, what you notice is something that was very similar to the Zodiac's emo when he made communications, which is that he used the paper that he write on with his message, fold it into a certain way to make the actual page the envelope itself that's mailed out.

18:39 And that's what has happened in this particular case. Well, if I'm now code this, I just want to say I would add the word traced the handwriting because I got so much out of this already. But anyways, so yeah, this is great, you know. Well, and so this Dickinson thing that we were talking about. So purportedly Tim Miller moved from Dickinson to League City, then his daughter's killed and at some point in two thousand and five, And I'm not sure if Tim Miller. Moved back to Texas to Dickinson or not after League City, in that the person was able to track and find and locate him where he was at. If this is a new address and not an old address, if this is an oiled address, it's to suggest that there's a meaning behind them sending it to him while he was in Dickinson.

19:31 So yeah, I would, I would just definitely add the work trace. But there's a lot going on there. A lot, And let's go through with you know, this call out on Pat is that Pat Cereal? I think he said his name was. Literally Pat Cereal. So Pat Cereal, the cop is a ridiculous fooler, NASA Horseman. Able is not the devil sought by the League City Blue Fuzz. So here he's saying that Able's not your person that you're looking for. And this is actually three years before Robert Abele purportedly commits self homicide. No, no, this. Is this is two thousand and five, right, Yeah, And I thought he made Robert Dabele had just died about this time, he's.

20:15 Gone, I thought, I thought he did that in two thousand and eight. Okay, well, well we'll get to it. But either way, even if he had just died, here you have somebody stepping out saying it wasn't him. That's not the guy you're looking for. They thought at this time period. And this is when, if I remember correctly, Tom Boyite got arrested for something that happened with the BTK cases. They thought, whoever was blind, I'm sorry to find torture a kill, which was that guy was also this in this mess and Pat Serial was the profiler for BTK, and Tom had trouble for something that happened and he ended up in jail. Dennis and I and a lot of people never let him with that.

21:09 Now, well, you know what's interesting is that I remember if it wasn't Sad Badge, then it was another anonymous writer who was speaking to me who had claimed that that Tom Voight was currently being held at an FBI location where he was being questioned by something. But this had to be after I was in the case, because I wouldn't he wouldn't have been telling you. He's like, you could check right now and call and find and blah blah blah. I looked at the institution that he was talking about, and he tried to assure me that, oh no, it's really legitimately this like black ops type stuff. You know, the FBI has got him here or something. I have the emails still, I'll find them, but those come obviously long after you know, all of this dastardly stuff has happened. All right, So some of the things that I wanted to talk about, and if I see that I'm repeating myself, I will try to skip over that.

22:01 Oh let me see what else I have here on my notes. Because I only made it through about one in three quarters of two of the three. Episodes on the Killing Fields. But some of the things that I picked up on was that the place that they were being dumped in on, called a road road, was owned by a petrol oil company. So now we have the oil cross connection. It's clearly a place somebody would have to be familiar with. Once again, they were laid under trees. Let's see, there was actually a blue plaid Western shirt that was found, I believe when they found Laura Miller's body, and they did market and I tried to take down the case number for that. Try to look back, maybe through some of the pictures I have of Jack and see if there's any, you know, shirts that would match what I saw. There was also a movie in nineteen eighty four that came out called The Killing Fields. So now we've got the media dubbing and they claimed that the media dubbed it the Killeen Fields. That is back to relating to a movie, just like many of the things that we saw with the Zodiac and relating back to movies.

23:13 Because the movie was about Cambodia. Lauds. Yeah, yeah, it was. I couldn't understood understand the word that she said, but it was a foreign word basically that I was not familiar with. I probably should have put on some subtitles. Maybe then I could have gotten that word down. But I think you're right it had something to do with another country. Can I can I ask something really quick, really quick? Okay? Dickinson in that area where Tim Miller and that that small town Dickinson, they had the Phillips sixty six refinery or oil stuff there, and then this this lot was an old Phillip sixty six pump jack planks. So there is the cross connections right.

24:03 There, right right, because we've got the Phillip sixty six map, we've got the inclined yap, we've got at marching on now. So there was a break. So they found the first body in. April of eighty four, let's see. But she so Heidi five went missing either November December nineteen eighty three, was found six months later in April of ninety. Four, And what do we have for Did I have that right? She went missing in September of eighty four, so this was after the fact, so maybe I have my year just a little bit off. But it took them another two years in nineteen eighty six to actually locate and find victim number two and Laura Miller. And then it took another five or six years in nineteen ninety is when they found the fourth victim, which was another Jane or they were both two does They didn't have identifications for these other two victims aside from Phi and from Miller.

25:12 And it says that by nineteen ninety one is when Robert abel had then now or now owned that section out there and called a road so he didn't own it from the beginning, he owned it. Maybe I think he'd already was owning it, but you know, they were finally saying something in nineteen ninety one. Oh, I know, and seeah, he definitely had a connection to that field. Well, but it's they specifically said when they found the fourth victim in nineteen ninety one. By this time, Robert abel was now the owner and running trail rides with horses throughout this property. So I'm going to call another like obvious illogical statement to blame this man is the fact that he's running horse trail rides through this property.

26:00 If he's jumping bodies, is that what you're going to do? Are you going to set up shop, run a business and allow people to go taking trail rides on horses? Were they potentially this bizarre? What's that? I said, it's bizarre, but it was happening. And then I think some kids found some remains. That would be the four kids found. Kids found a victim number two, which led to victim number three, which was Laura Miller, and then the fourth body was found probably by kids again too. Again, I didn't commit any of that memories, but they were. Independent without his help, they weren't on like these trail rides.

26:44 With it right. These individuals were out well. Like I said, the first three were found, Robert abel did not own this property. It wasn't until they found the fourth victim in nineteen ninety one that that now Robert abel is owning it, operating running yeah, trail rides. So I don't honestly see a serial killer. Let me bring the public into my secret spot. I just don't see this happening. You guys, yeah, unless you want to be hot exactly. And they did do a search warrant on Robert Abeles place, obviously not finding anything that connected him to the murders. One of the things that I did take note to is that Tim Miller had indicated that at one point in time he had gone back to.

27:32 Visit his daughter's grave or the place where she was left. Dead, and he had found DVDs that had x x X written on them in sharpy pen Now number one. I found the same type of DVDs in Jack's belongings. Dennis and I were not able to get them to play. I don't know if that is because the technology was so different between the time that they were created and the new computer systems that were working off of. But we could not get these DVDs to play, and really what we thought we were going to see was probably porn since it said xx X. Hold on, Hold on one second, guys, yet, go ahead, Nolan, Well.

28:17 They may be CDs and not DVDs. Maybe there's audio. They could have been. You may be right. I don't know that Tim Miller was able to get anything off of them either. I don't recall him stating he just remembered what was written on them and he turned those over to the police as well. So you're you're completely right they could have been CDs. Let's see. Race Bolling Gear. I got Grace Bowling Gear de coded of the evidence. Right, and that was two of the girls. You think that Robert Abel was responsible for making triple rated videos of and. So somebody along with other people anyways, right.

29:01 Well didn't you see? Okay, but that the people were all people that knew Robert Able threw NASA right like brace well. And yeah, John, it's it's naming John Walsh, and that this stuff went to a very young and up and coming guy that knew Spielberg. So I mean I'm trying to Lucas Lucas Lucas. Yes, it's it's It's just bizarre. What was Abel's position at NASA. He was a scientist, He actually created one of the rockets. Okay, so it was a little close to Houston.

29:45 Then, well, he's in it. He's he was in the He now owns the Called Road property by the time they find the fourth victim, So he was in the Galveston area for sure, and close by to League City. But again, uh, the. Information that they said, I guess that the FBI did a profile based on the murders, and Robert Abel purportedly fit the profile, and that's why they started looking at him, not only because he fit that profile, but that he owned the property where the fourth person came up missing, and that he inserted himself in the case by offering his horses at search parties, doing everything he could to search the property that he now owns. I mean, I would help if people were being found dead on my property and I wasn't responsible, I'd give all the axecutes who never needed it to absolutely search my property, look for whatever you can.

30:40 I think he was actually hoping because I'm being a guy through many other aspects, other people anyways, that he was actually trying to get himself arrested because he knew he couldn't stop Sophie got arrested, then, you know, so of course he's going to say, well, you know, I've tried in the past to say I'm compelled to do these horrible things, and he knows it's horrible. Arrest me, right, right, But he's he's got top secret NASA information in his head, so they weren't going to interrogate him. So he eventually died. So what happened between this spirit and the time he died. He never got recuge, never got wayne or arrested.

31:27 She's saying that this happened to him. No, he wasn't because they didn't find anything, right, didn't. He didn't find anything. I've seen so many stories about him, people said, why didn't they see this? Why didn't And then I've seen Robert Abel over the years of different sources saying that he was trying to get help and he couldn't get help, and that he worked for NASA and he had top secret information in his head. So but that's why you weren't they were going to conveniently not find the bones and things that were on his proper. There's stuff that people told, stories that made kids feel like a horror just to if you look at Rubert Abel that they were scared to even be in the store with him.

32:11 Because yeah, once the media, once the media is weaponized against you. And when I'm watching many of these cases, I just did the thailant all murders as well. And when I'm watching what the media does to somebody, you have little to no chance of getting out from underneath the scrutiny once they've set their eyes on you. And in many cases that we've discussed, where Jack says, hey, I know that there are people hemmed up for my crimes. They looked at that one person and they didn't move or budge from that person, which meant they weren't looking at anybody else. Was a Freemason. Oh, I have no idea that I wantn't ask. The people are freemasons, all the astronauts and most of the horror.

32:53 I think I think he definitely had some old family connections. His family goes way back. I think if I remember writing a couple of centuries, so I would think he had some Freemason family members. I remember having to read so much about him in order to get anything that I was working on correct. And he's he's got some old family history. Well, at least for the amount of crimes in the League City field of deaths and some of the eighties, whether Abel did actually, you know, get involved with things as yourselves suggests. We have the letter stating that there are other people involved, that our suspect writing this letter to Tim Miller is not the only person who was killing people in the eighties, and that Robert Abel is not the blue Fuzz is not I'm sorry, it is not the double saught by the League City Blue Fuzz.

33:47 So Robert Able may very well not have been responsible for any of the League City deaths. There's them Ed Bell and oh, let's see other names. There's a couple of other that are pretty bad. And so this is alluding to these other creeps, so to speak. Well, And at one point when Dennis had come back from his from his visit with Tim Miller, he had expressed me that Tim Miller had relayed to him that he had been involved with drugs at the time his daughter had gone missing. And the drug that Dennis stated was cocaine, and that wraps us right back around things like we're hearing about the Walshes and about other people involved with things that might be stepping on other people's toes.

34:35 They're going to make sure you're not getting too big or you know, take out someone you love to kind of impede your progress from from becoming I guess the kingpin of that area Elain. All I know is I see during Reagan he was actually using and allowing the not himself using cocaine, but using the cocaine industry as a way to get information on other people. I mean, Pablo Escobar was like making billions in under Reagan. So you've got all the other people in the cocaine world. I mean, it was snowing in San Francisco every day in a city that doesn't get snow. I was trying to go to school with that for education. Oh my god. So I can go on and on, but it's like they said, well, cocaine is huge, so we can use it to kind of sort of blackmail people.

35:32 Well, and also to fund things. If they confiscated it or money and seizures associated with it, then that becomes their funding for whatever other tasks that they have at hand or weapons from. So they were in the CIA and the offshoots that CIA were involved in the cocaine trade and they were using and then they also it was also involved in the Ratan and the hostage thing and negotiate students for given weatherons to different factions of Iranians that we supported. They were all, you know. Our enemy at the time, but that didn't matter and they use that to help win the election.

36:13 So it was kind of scary because the news and the media was actually portraying Laura Miller to be the person involved with people doing drugs. They mentioned she smoked pot. Oh good lord, the devil's let us. She's just a huge drug person, right, Like, I don't even know where to go from there. But Tim Miller was obviously very upset over the fact that the news was portraying his daughter this way, portrayed her as a runaway somebody that just give it time and she'll come back. Even after finding Heidi Fi's body and him stating, please search this area for my daughter as well, and them saying no, no, no, it's. Not related that da da da da. But it wasn't until nineteen ninety seven, when another girl had gone missing, Laura Smithers, who literally came from an affluent family in a good area, with no reason to believe that she would be involved with drugs, gangs or other things that we saw, you know, a full on flood.

37:13 They said they had something like six thousand people assisting in the search for this girl once they found her missing. And that is not how they treated five. That is not how they treated Laura Miller. That is not how they treated the other cases of missing women. And I think that the reporter said there was something like thirty three unsolved missing and murdered women during. This seventies, late seventies to early nineties and nineties killings that have happened, and none of them. Received the intention that this one little girl did. All right, Well, that hops us right back into Jack's stuff at this point. And in September first of nineteen eighty four, which is what I had talked about before, I thought that this particular date was the same date that Laura had gone missing, but it is not. So September first is when Jack fills out this Plaster County Probation Department.

38:06 I guess it's a questionnaire where you employed. What do you have going on? You know, da da, da da, all of these different things. Now I want to bring to everybody's attention that this was It says that it's dated the monthly report for nine to one of nineteen eighty four, but there's a post it note over here to the right. That says mailed for one of nineteen eighty five. So, for whatever reason, while it was supposedly filled out in September, was not mailed for a good seven months, eight months to the probation department. We do see Jack with his blue Chevy pickup truck with a white camper shell, and I do realize that there are some murders where the sightings were white camper shells on blue trucks in Texas.

38:51 But it does say up here in the notes that he is driving Urine Make sixty four Chevy pickup and the license plate number on this particular vehicle, so we can't see that those are confirmed for the timeframe of what I believe that Jack had this vehicle because we did actually see the registration card where he had purchased it. I believe from was it was Nora's grandfather, right Chacne, Yeah, all right, so let's see. So this is also the first time that I see that he's working for Hewlett Packard and he is on contract from California Plant or for California Plant Protection from Pinkerton, and this is his first real job that I've even noted that he's held for more than ten years. So he is still listing the Kirby Street address in Roseville, which we know is Nora's, but we know that there was also a time frame that he had separated. Nora moved into the Kirby Street address, and at some point in time Jack then followed her back. Let's see, No, it's not it's literally like ten not even ten minutes around the corner. And I you know the house because Jennis would pointed out every single time we.

40:04 Drove by it. He would say, that's the house where we lived, right there. Okay, so. Let's move on to my next So another thing I want everybody to pay attention to is that not only did it say on that post, it note that he mailed it on four to one of nineteen eighty five. I'm looking at and scanned an original copy of this probation report. So if I scanned an original copy of this probation report, yet there's a post a note on it saying that it was mailed. That means that there was more than one version of this report created, just like the Zodiac, so he took the time to fill out too, so that he had one in his possession. Otherwise the original would have been mailed to the actual entity or to the probation department with the information and his signature. Because he's certifying what I think this is really for them to check to see how much he should have to pay.

40:56 And it is listing that he has child. Support here sixty dollars a month now in nineteen eighty four, I feel like that would I feel like all of Jack's former children with Litha Marie Selth would have been over the age of eighteen, wouldn't you think, Harriet. Yeah, I think it's only for Charles. So that makes me question whether or not he is really with Nora at this time. Why would he be paying child support if he's living at home. We know they got the divorce. They got the divorce when he tried to attack the family and add the assault with a deadly weapon. But now we're seeing that there's child support on here so that brings to mind again, is Jack back with Nora at this.

41:39 Point in time? Maybe maybe not otherwise, or or he is back with her not really paying her the child support he's ordered, but he's just using that to take away from his income that they could ask for because that sixty dollars goes to the children. That's your question too. It seems like right off the top, it says that timeless timeliness is of the essence before the tenth of the month. So he fills it out on the first. It's got to mail it by September tenth. Why did until April? Or did he actually mail a version in September and then mail again in April. I don't know. It's kind of weird. Yeah, no, he his post it note on it says that he mailed for one eighty five, and so he's making his own note of that. And you guys, I mean, sometimes you got to do valid It.

42:31 Says as me, the month that's filled out has to be mailed by the tenth that was September of eighty four. Jack didn't do a lot. Jack didn't do a lot of things like the average public would be exactly right. I would think they would reject it the probation department. Right, I don't even understand what the purpose of mailing it on four one of eighty. Five would be. However, like I said, it's signed and dated on nine to one eighty four right as. It was mailed on. So confusion at best. But still he's in possession of the original. So did he make two? Like the Zodiac I also took. You know, as I sit here and I look some of these pages or some of the pages that I used in the examination of the Zodiac case, and there are a lot of things in there, like that pop up that pop up giant K that we talk about, the other formations, or things like let me see here the four stroke ends.

43:28 That actually look like w's. So look at this N over here at the end of Sunday, that is, it looks just like a W. Look at the N and plant just like a W. And we've seen a lot of these formations in the Zodiac handwriting, which is a lead to the fact that that author, on the occasion that he dropped it, is used to using this formation, which is basically a capital. And let me see if I can find one that looks more like an n here in the in the word none. Okay, sorry, yeah, in the word none. What you see is this little tail sticking up here at the top of the left side of the end. And that's because he starts there, moves downward, moves back up to make that first hump of the end before making the cross in the center, and then coming back up off of the baseline on the final leg of the end.

44:21 So it's basically this little stroke that we're seeing here to the left is actually left open in his carelessness, so it makes it look like a W. And on the Zodiac stuff, it looked more like what I referred to as a bird flying because it had kind of that wing w look. Even though you couldn't it didn't fully articulate the letter full on like we see it here. It is still that same movement. This handwriting, which is to me it appears to be just California. He tried to alter his own handwriting. But he did it, really a lot of it. I think that when.

45:04 It comes through, but it's not the same as this. I think that that Jack's manipulation of his handwriting as the Zodiac was the attempt to make everything lowercase. That was properly lowercase, with the common habit of leaving behind capital letters, and that and these and these letters we've discussed before, these capital letters that we find in the Zodiac's handwriting that pop up here and there, that those capital letters are consistent with the capital letters and Jack's and we see them dropped so so minutely. There. There's just a very few of them that lead you back. As a document examiner to say he forgot who he was being at this point in time. His brain took over and started to drop natural handwriting.

45:50 There's the issue of spacing too, like he would separate words. I think a lot of that, a lot of those things he was doing in those letters. The it was there, which is what we believe that were maybe clues. It was right, it's pantographic code. That's why I found so much because why would have a brilliant guy, he is a brilliant mind. Why would he not know how to spell words and you know, put stuff. That's what caught my attention. Yeah, Well, there's also the hyphenating of words where sometimes he didn't even use the hyphen He just broke the word on one line and then started the second half of the word down here and sometimes hyphenating, sometimes not hyphenating, but awkward breaks when there was enough room to write the full words.

46:35 So that's what doesn't make any sense. And the Zodiac clearly showed the use of all space on the paper. So why in those particular instances would he break the word in half so that the second half of it fell on another line unless there was a purpose behind doing so, because he did not have a problem writing right up to the edge of the paper by any means. Can we look at the full document again, because it's his writing scene just so precise and like professional, it's just it's amazing, really. But when you look a lot of them, when you look at a lot of the. Forms, you see the consistency. So looking at his name Jack, where he writes lowercase A, which is that bell top A, but then in Terrance he uses capital a's right.

47:27 So there's this mix back and forth. But when you look at things like the ms, the seas, I think the sea's were some of the things that when the nine to eleven letters were mailed that people were really kind of jumping onto as far as what looked like the zodiac. But the piece that. Decided on the lines themselves, everything just to the lines, and they're all very straight, very neat. And that is something that I actually say that the Zodiac had in his ability to write on unlike paper per food lines like he is manuscripting law. Yeah, yeah, very controlled basically. So November eighth of nineteen eighty four, we had a man named Robert William Hope, thirty two years of age, that was killed. It looks like he was on the eighteen hundred block of North Park in Kingwood, Texas. So this is back in Texas at this point in time. If I'm to presume that in September of nineteen eighty four, Jack is still paying child support, if.

48:30 That wasn't a lie. Oh, we we're down to our last minute. I think I will save this slide before getting into this one for next week. But is there any last comments that anybody has in regards to today's information. Well, I'm thankful that you warphed into the sections of where he's purposely breaking up the words, and that's where me the codebreaker comes in. I recognize the the center graphic code, and I'd sure like to know how he learned it, but I'm seeing it years year is the years before Jack. Maybe through the military, maybe through the Navy, the Air Force, right right, Yeah, he could have been part of a bigger organization that we even begin to understand. But we know that when he was in at Sugi, Japan, that's where he learned code, ham, radio and all of the things that American airmen were required to do on that base in order to fulfill their duties.

49:28 So all of his. Right, all right, you guys, Well, I want to wish everybody a wonderful weekend. I have a great next week. We will see you all next Friday. It feels better yours too. They must do the